Arlo|Smart Home Security|Wireless HD Security Cameras

Re: Outside Recording Delay

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WernerS
Star
Star

I am a professional engineer of 20+ years and I do deal a lot with algorithm and software design. I do think I am somewhat capable of following basic installation instruction. I did move the cameras around several times and tried pretty much all suggestions. I am absolutely confident I have a very good installation. The fact is, not a single suggestions provided any significant improvement and I'm obviously not alone.

 

I am reluctant to purchase another set of cameras to utilize a trigger-function to compensate for a design flaw and to pay for a higher subscription fee for an inferior system.

 

It is completely out of my comprehension how a system with this type of substantial design flaw can get approved for mass production. The single purpose of the cameras is to record video. It fails to record the most important part of the video.

 

- If somebody steals a delivered package from my front porch --> The camera completley misses the entire action

- If someone sneaks through my back door --> The camera completley misses the entire action

- If somebody walks into my open garage --> The camera completley misses the entire action

etc.

 

This system is pretty much useless for me for the purpose I have purchased it.

 

I gave up after all that frustration and now I was going to use the system to make some home videos instead of using it as a surveillance system. But that is not possible either because it cant do continuous recording either.

 

You may also consider that some people get so frustrated after a while that they gave up on comming back to the forum commenting on all the ineffectiv suggestions. I am one of them. This system is garbage period

 

 

 

Hula_Rock
Prodigy Prodigy
Prodigy

A FIRESTORM has started.

 

As I stated long ago, Netgear add a disclaimer in the Packaging "May take up to 2 seconds before actual recording starts"

DRGinLBC
Guide
Guide

Having a hard time believing "jguerdat" doesn't have his hand in the Netgear cookie jar.  Judging by number of posts alone and his pure defense of this flawed system.

 

Also a tad skeptical that his suggestion is to purchase a $140 "trigger" camera to make the system work properly.

 

 

Schorschi
Prodigy
Prodigy
Well, it's like with a girl-friend you fall in love with. You love everything about her. Then suddenly you're married to her and you don't have a choice but to love her. SCNR.
mirthful1
Tutor
Tutor

Glad to see you all are keeping up the fight. I resigned myself to this delay issue with the camera months ago.  Someday I'll get one of those class action lawsuit settlement checks for 20$ or some such.  The simple fact that they have not put out an update for the devices (that I'm aware of) means that the issue is intractable and not addressable with what we bought.  Oh well.  I can't say I hate the thing.  It's just this delay really compromises its usefulness.    Best of luck to you all.  I know the issue and its real... And most (not all, for sure) of the obfuscating 'help' is just a waste of time...

Model: Arlo Wire Free
RobertRosal
Virtuoso
Virtuoso

The delay is there!

 

Though a little late to the parade, I agree, we are not all that stupid.  I read the instructions, positioning does help, but not good enough.

 

No sugar coating here.

 

 

-Robert
Hula_Rock
Prodigy Prodigy
Prodigy

I even brought home a $70,000 Spectrum Analyzer to scan for Rougue Frequencies that could be affecting my Wifi conneciton with the Cameras,  Took Laser Thermal Readings, Flir Thermal Images, and still no luck.  I have come to a conclusion that in a Dynamic outdoor environment, topped with the Delay, ARLO FLAT OUT FALLS FLAT ON ITS FACE....

rgt
Aspirant
Aspirant

YES, the delay of start of recording makes this almost useless... very disapointed. I finally mounted both cameras outside to monitor driveway and front door. the alerts show a start time when the person is done and leaving the front door, and when a car is all the way up a 50 yard driveway... there must be a fix for this, or an alternate product to buy. 

Model: Arlo Wire Free
aaronjh
Guide
Guide

A few days ago, I installed an Arlo device, about two metres from the base station (it is outside the garage door, the Arlo base station is in my comms cabinet inside the garage door).

 

It catches me when I'm driving out, checking the mailbox, or taking the garbage bins out to the street.

 

However, the lag is up to 10 seconds from motion. It's all installed pretty much perfectly - I'm moving across the FoV, it's looking straight at the area of motion (edge-to-edge), etc.

 

It detects me every time, but the lag is pretty crazy. I'll be well past the camera by the time it starts recording, and it will miss me going out of the garage entirely, and only catch me coming back in. If it's a rainy day, I'll run to put the bins out, and it will just catch the tail end of me running back in. I can literally run to the kerb, put the bins out, and run back before it starts recording.

 

The indoor cameras are similar. If I come home from shopping and neglect to disable the alarm, I'll be putting groceries in the fridge by the time the recording starts, despite the trigger camera being placed catch the entryway door (again with me moving across the FoV).

 

During motion tests, I get consistent orange lights with any motion. It's just the delay between the detection and recording starting that seems to be the problem. I can only assume the cameras take some time to wake out of sleep state.

TomMac
Guru Guru
Guru

@aaronjh

 

 

 

Yes, the Orange testing light works faster as the camera is in usage mode at that time and the PIR is pretty responsive.  The delay to wake up the cameras for record takes a couple of seconds as when not in use the camera goes to sleep to conserve batteries.... but 10 second IMO , seems excessive.

 

I would move the camera around in the garage and test it in a few different locations to see if you can't improove the time...it is a trial and error process. My delay is <2 seconds from sense to record on all 8 of the cameras.

 

One trick I've learned that improves the detect time is as follows;

 

Go into the settings for the pan/crop of what the camera sees. SETTINGS-CAMERA- bottom of page for pan-zoom

( btw the PIR sees the entire view even if you shrink the view here )

Shrink / crop the view down about 10-15 % so you sort of have a small border around the total view... Save and adjust camera for view wanted with the cropped picture.

 

End result is the PIR sees ALL the lens does, but you've made the picture slightly smaller so the sense(PIR) causes the startup of the camera BEFORE the subject actually enters the cropped view. Motion set for about 90-95 % sensitivities

 

For me, It ends up the subjust is just entering the picture as the recording start so it appears to start recording instantly.

 

Would be interested if it works for you

--------------------------------------
Morse is faster than texting!
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Paul_FCCL
Prodigy
Prodigy

I have done same with my cameras........it does make a slight difference, improved delay from ~4 secs. down to about 2 secs.

Not bad.

Thanks for suggestion.

 

aaronjh
Guide
Guide

TomMac wrote:

I would move the camera around in the garage and test it in a few different locations to see if you can't improove the time...it is a trial and error process. My delay is <2 seconds from sense to record on all 8 of the cameras.


The cameras are all placed as optimally as possible. I played with a dozen different locations for each when installing them, testing delays and ensuring a high rate of motion detection at the periphery of the FoV each time.

 

I've played with all three cameras again today, walking across the camera's view at a moderate pace.

 

It actually seems to make a difference how long you leave the cameras sit before you test them. For my first test, all three of the cameras had a delay in the range of 5-9 seconds from entering the FoV to the recording beginning (after they had been "sleeping" with motion enabled but no detections overnight). This meant I was out of the frame by the time the recording began.

 

For the second detection, a few minutes later, the delay was in the range of 3-7 seconds from entering the FoV. This is better, but it still meant that all but one of the cameras just caught the back of me as I was walking out of the frame. Subsequent tests showed similar results, with no consistency in the times. No single camera was faster than the others. The distribution of delays seemed random across them for each test.

 

 

I'm wondering why I'm seeing delays of up to 9 seconds, while others are reporting 2 seconds. The cameras are very close to the base station, and there are sizeable delays even with synthetic tests where the cameras are placed optimally. I'm also wondering why there is such large variance between the times to start recording the individual tests.

 

Could it be that the cameras or base station actually need to negotiate with the cloud server to begin streaming the video, rather than buffering it locally? If so, then internet latency could play a part. I'm located in Australia, and latency to servers in the US and Europe is obviously quite high. If the videos are streamed directly to the cloud, then a few seconds delay in authenticating and establishing the streaming would make perfect sense... but is obviously not desirable.

 

 


Go into the settings for the pan/crop of what the camera sees. SETTINGS-CAMERA- bottom of page for pan-zoom

( btw the PIR sees the entire view even if you shrink the view here )

Shrink / crop the view down about 10-15 % so you sort of have a small border around the total view... Save and adjust camera for view wanted with the cropped picture.


This just shrinks the image resolution and the field of view. It may improve the perception of speed, but it does nothing to improve the actual performance.

 

I already have the cameras placed to capture the widest possible field of view while still being close enough to guarantee motion detection. Moving cameras away from the detection area would just cause more attenuation of the IR signal and actually decrease the chance of getting an IR "hit". It may improve the perception of speed, but it's only doing so by cropping off part of the image that could have valuable data in it.

rgt
Aspirant
Aspirant

Thanks, I have reset the zone that it senses, and will see if it makes any difference. So far, nothing noticeable. The cameras are both within 20' of a wifi hotspot, so that's not doing anything... 

 

I may have to try the suggestion of setting up a trigger camera down the driveway and see if it starts the others recording... Before spending the extra money (or returning the whole setup) - can you set the trigger camera to start two cameras recording? Or, can the one that's triggered start another one AND begin recording as well????

Model: Arlo Wire Free
aaronjh
Guide
Guide

rgt wrote:

I may have to try the suggestion of setting up a trigger camera down the driveway and see if it starts the others recording... Before spending the extra money (or returning the whole setup) - can you set the trigger camera to start two cameras recording? Or, can the one that's triggered start another one AND begin recording as well????


You can set individual rules so that when one camera is triggered, another can record. If you set two of these rules, two cameras will begin to record. One of those can be the trigger camera, or they could be entirely separate cameras.

 

Basically the logic looks like this:

Rule 1: if [camera x detects motion]: set camera x to record

Rule 2: if [camera x detects motion]: set camera y to record

Rule 3: if [camera x detects motion]: set camera z to record

 

You can have as many rules as you like. 

Paul_FCCL
Prodigy
Prodigy

rgt

 

Yes, I believe you can trigger motion from one camera and record to an other, or even set recording on two other cameras. However I would expect the trigger/recording lag to get worse, more so with the latter.

Worth a try......

Good luck!

 

rgt
Aspirant
Aspirant

Did reset the zones, and it still starts the recording after a delivery person came to the door and caught them after they were leaving... makes that marginally usefull.  Have to see if investing in a trigger camera will make this setup any more useful. 

Model: Arlo Wire Free
TomMac
Guru Guru
Guru

aaronjh wrote

Could it be that the cameras or base station actually need to negotiate with the cloud server to begin streaming the video, rather than buffering it locally? If so, then internet latency could play a part. I'm located in Australia, and latency to servers in the US and Europe is obviously quite high. If the videos are streamed directly to the cloud, then a few seconds delay in authenticating and establishing the streaming would make perfect sense... but is obviously not desirable.



This just shrinks the image resolution and the field of view. It may improve the perception of speed, but it does nothing to improve the actual performance.

I already have the cameras placed to capture the widest possible field of view while still being close enough to guarantee motion detection. Moving cameras away from the detection area would just cause more attenuation of the IR signal and actually decrease the chance of getting an IR "hit". It may improve the perception of speed, but it's only doing so by cropping off part of the image that could have valuable data in it.


 

Yes , it could be the latency causing the problems

 

As it improving the actual performace, I know it does nothing.... But I was willing to give up a little FOV in areas to make it appear the speed factor increased.

For me where I have used this trick I didn't need the full view anyway ( as it was small area ). But the end result is I do get the subject walking up to the camera.

 

--------------------------------------
Morse is faster than texting!
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jguerdat
Guru Guru
Guru

Not that we can do anything about it but I do wish the various servers were centrally located relative to the user's location. Using overseas servers may not be the real issue but it certainly doesn't help.

Paul_FCCL
Prodigy
Prodigy

Still a big problem............ long recording delays still a pretty noticeable flaw. It's a hit-and-miss kind of performance, some times it seems to be not so bad, other times I'll be staring at a few empty videos.

I know something triggers the recording (was getting the garbage out this a.m. and no pic) but all I get are blank videos.

One day I tried testing the motion speed factor, I slowed down my walking across the camera view almost in a slow-motion and YES it did pick me up for the full recording path. I walk at normal speed and NO there is nothing in the video. Guess we better hope burglars don't move too fast when breaking-in so that Arlo camera has enough time for the recording.

 

Really wish Netgear could do something about this problem.

 

Paul

 

 

WernerS
Star
Star

I did do something .... I sold my system on ebay. bye bye Arlo

aaronjh
Guide
Guide

I ended up giving up on trying to fix the problem. Lots of Wireshark worked showed that it is due to latency back to the cloud servers - so there's no real solution on the user side.

 

In the end, I just increased the recording time to 30 seconds. At least that way, when I miss the first 5-6 seconds of a video, I still have some form of video recorded afterwards (that sometimes even has a person in it).

 

It's an almost product-killing defect, unless you're lucky enough to live somewhere with good latency back to the servers (i.e. definitely not here in Australia). However, for my purposes, the product almost does the job, so I've given up on trying to solve it. I just see Arlo as a motion detector that then has a camera that kicks in some time afterwards, rather than actually as a motion-detecing camera.

 

I just wish I knew of this problem beforehand, so I could have chosen a better option.

rgt
Aspirant
Aspirant

I am very frustrated as well... Added an additional camera as a "trigger" for the driveway. Waiting til someone or something got to the camera wAs useless. 

 

So, what did you buy to replace the Arlo's?

Model: VMC3030 | Arlo Wire-Free Camera
Paul_FCCL
Prodigy
Prodigy

rgt wrote:

I am very frustrated as well... Added an additional camera as a "trigger" for the driveway. Waiting til someone or something got to the camera wAs useless. 

 

So, what did you buy to replace the Arlo's?


Yeah it's pretty obvious by now, have finally given up on this useless system. I regret putting so much money into it, have four cameras and wish I hadn't spent so much for literally nothing.

Began using Arlo last fall, I wasted so much time trying different things, thinking I could eventually fix all the small glitches. I also believed Netgear would come through with required fixes for the ever so much reported problems, sooner or later.

After nine months of frustrations and endless changes, cameras repositioning etc., I have to say enough of this $&@#% it's not "ever" going to be a reliable security system. Nice gadget, works good at times..... not so good or not at all too many other times.

The unacceptably long video delay is there to stay. I don't know about this "server latency" issue, it should not be there, Netgear should have servers all over the locations where they sell their products, no excuses.

Also, they need to explain to us why their cameras don't always work, how you can drive a car in and out of a garage without motion triggering. Some times cameras just don't wake up no matter how much motion.

I have walked in front of two armed cameras, five-six times.....back and forth, no motion trigger. Tried again a few minutes later, and surprise surprise now it works!

All unexplainable scenarios, one final conclusion, it's a bad product. Good idea but a big waste of money and time. Arlo users should consider a class action law suit, we have all been ripped off and should get our money back.

Sorry.......but it had to be said.

Regards,

Paul

rgt
Aspirant
Aspirant

I agree with all your issues... The instant there is a credible battery powered alternative, I will replace the hopelessly ineffective ARLO camera system. late triggering, missed events, and weak resolution are all unacceptable. I even went and bought an additional camera to try and trigger approaches to the house to cut down the lag... some of those events don't take either. 

 

I have installed a RING doorbell Pro, and that seems to work well. not missing any events yet. But it's powered by the doorbell transformer, and only covers one spot. They have a new camera that's an add on. May try that and see if I eliminate the whole Arlo system. 

 

Shame on Netgear for selling such sub par products. 

Model: VMC3030 | Arlo Wire-Free Camera
Hula_Rock
Prodigy Prodigy
Prodigy

Paul_FCCL wrote:

rgt wrote:

I am very frustrated as well... Added an additional camera as a "trigger" for the driveway. Waiting til someone or something got to the camera wAs useless. 

 

So, what did you buy to replace the Arlo's?


Yeah it's pretty obvious by now, have finally given up on this useless system. I regret putting so much money into it, have four cameras and wish I hadn't spent so much for literally nothing.

Began using Arlo last fall, I wasted so much time trying different things, thinking I could eventually fix all the small glitches. I also believed Netgear would come through with required fixes for the ever so much reported problems, sooner or later.

After nine months of frustrations and endless changes, cameras repositioning etc., I have to say enough of this $&@#% it's not "ever" going to be a reliable security system. Nice gadget, works good at times..... not so good or not at all too many other times.

The unacceptably long video delay is there to stay. I don't know about this "server latency" issue, it should not be there, Netgear should have servers all over the locations where they sell their products, no excuses.

Also, they need to explain to us why their cameras don't always work, how you can drive a car in and out of a garage without motion triggering. Some times cameras just don't wake up no matter how much motion.

I have walked in front of two armed cameras, five-six times.....back and forth, no motion trigger. Tried again a few minutes later, and surprise surprise now it works!

All unexplainable scenarios, one final conclusion, it's a bad product. Good idea but a big waste of money and time. Arlo users should consider a class action law suit, we have all been ripped off and should get our money back.

Sorry.......but it had to be said.

Regards,

Paul


@Paul_FCCL

 

Oddly enough I too experienced the WEB CAM missing a car driving in and out of my garage recently.  Normally it catches my wife leaving in the morning, but nothing.  The Crazy thing is, she back out of the garage, sits in the driveway and waits until the garage door shuts 100% before leaving.  NORMALY the camera mounted over the driveway catches her and start recording when she is sitting there watching the garage door close.  Lately, NOTHING !!!!! and the car passes no more than 7 feet from the camera.

 

We all know how I feel about the "Delay".  I have given up on these WEB CAMS long time ago and plan on shutting this system down as soon as the batteries die on the cameras.  We all had high hopes for this system only to be dissappointed in the long run.

 

PS.  I ike the idea of a CLASS ACTION SUIT to get our money back....