topic Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input in Arlo Pro

Sun-Related False Positives - Looking For Input

DLinkOZ — Thu, 27 Sep 2018 15:05:27 GMT

Since I moved into my new house, sunny days give me about 5-6 hours of frequent false positives. I understand the sun being a source of IR and all, and am looking for input to resolve the problem. The current mounts I'm using, VMA4000, only allow me to go to approximately 45 degrees (limiting my ability to adjust around the problem as well as severely overlapping the other camera). Due to this, I've bought a VMA1000 to hopefully give me a better range of motion. So if anyone has any ideas, please keep that in mind as well as I'd like to rotate the problem camera more to the right to capture back to the front porch and less of the driveway that's already covered by the other camera.

Now, some pictures. Note that my house faces south, so the sun rises to the right of the cameras and sets to the left.

Mid morning, when the false positives start. Note that tree shadow comes into view at the same time.Late afternoon, when there are no false positivesSecond camera, never has false positives

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

jguerdat — Fri, 09 Mar 2018 20:58:19 GMT

A couple of possibilities:

1) Is there wind obvious when the false detections happen? I'm thinking the bushes may be moving in the wide, causing IR reflection.

2) Since a little bit of the road is visible, is it possible that traffic is causing this?

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

TomMac — Fri, 09 Mar 2018 21:04:07 GMT

First thing I would try is to swap the two cams...see if the false trigger problem follows the camera.

Second would be to adjust a bit lower the since level on the problemed camera

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Fri, 09 Mar 2018 22:10:02 GMT

Wind or not, this happens when the sun is out (we've had rain lately, and on those days it does not happen).
It does not correspond to traffic, many days my son's car is parked by the tree causing that thin shadow and it still happens (this would block visible cars driving by), and the other camera sees far more action (vehicles, people working on the house next door, etc) and it never does this.
Like so many others, I have tried much lower settings and it still happens.
I can try swapping them this weekend.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Fri, 09 Mar 2018 22:13:49 GMT

While I was out, it stopped alerting (as it does every afternoon). So this happened today between 10am and 3pm. Here's the final picture. I know shadows shouldn't cause this, but could it be the shadow breaking up the IR reflection on the sidewalk?

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Mon, 12 Mar 2018 21:40:11 GMT

I installed the new mount, which allowed me to get 90 degrees out from the driveway camera. I couldn't do this with the existing mount due to a downspout for my gutter being in the way, the new mount gave me the 90 degrees and also pushed it out far enough towards the street to see around it. I'm hoping this resolves my sun issue while also providing much better coverage of the front yard.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

newArloPro_user — Mon, 19 Mar 2018 12:22:53 GMT

Did this resolve your issue? Did you swap your cameras? I am having the same issue with one of my camera while the sun is shining on it. Wondering if I have to mount it higher or something.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Mon, 19 Mar 2018 12:35:09 GMT

Swapping did no good. The new mount helped quite a bit with the new angle, but I do have bad days where I get frequent false positives. There's no rhyme or reason, two equally sunny days may or may not be problematic. But it did cut down by at least 75%. Just wish I could get that remainder down so I bring the sensitivity back up so it's as useful as it should be.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Mon, 19 Mar 2018 13:38:56 GMT

Here's the seemingly minor change in angle that the new mount provides. But it actually makes a huge difference in what the camera sees.

Old mountNew mountNew view

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Wed, 11 Apr 2018 16:10:12 GMT

Still not resolved. Even moving the mount so it faces the same general direction as the one without issues results in false positives. I've switched the cameras, and the problem follows the location, not the camera. In the attached pic, the "Front Yard" is problematic, while "Driveway" is the same location and angle and has never experienced this.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Wed, 11 Apr 2018 19:04:38 GMT

Does anyone know if Arlo Smart (http://www.arlo.com/en-us/landing/arlosmart/) will also help alleviate sun-related false positives, or only minor motion?

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

jguerdat — Wed, 11 Apr 2018 19:56:50 GMT

Smart won't do a thing for false positives other than to reduce the number of notifications. It just tries to identify people and alert then.

Reducing sun-related false triggers requires reducing sensitivity (only to the point where you can still get the motion recordings you need) and/or changing camera position to eliminate the sources of the triggers, such as cars, moving branches/leaves, etc. Also, don't forget that as the sun's angle changes the reflections will also so you may need various modes with various sensitivity settings to be used at different times of the year.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Wed, 11 Apr 2018 21:15:03 GMT

That's where I am, I've actually changed the angle and completely moved it to another side of the house (so it's angled in very different position). I've reduced sensitivity down to 10% as well. Nothing resolves it, and I've had to disable alerting on that camera (which makes it next to useless, unfortunately). As you can see from the screenshot, the alerts come entirely too frequently and generate too much noise (would drown out any actionable alerting) and runs the entire battery down in 2-3 weeks. My Ring doorbell has a setting that hones in on people, and using it took it from false positives to perfection.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

jguerdat — Thu, 12 Apr 2018 01:26:19 GMT

I would open a case with support here for the possibility of a faulty camera.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Thu, 12 Apr 2018 01:50:10 GMT

I would've thought the camera was faulty as well, but when I switched cameras between the two positions it didn't follow the hardware. Still owe Netgear a contact, though.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

Retired_Member — Thu, 27 Sep 2018 02:41:28 GMT

yeah i have the same issue now

Had Arlo for a few years now and worked great until about 6 months ago , the cameras have been in the same position with no changes to the outdoors areas in terms of sun shade / buildings trees etc .

However over the last six months keep getting a huge amount of false triggers on all the outdoor cameras when there is a lot of sun/ shade . I suspect Alro / netgear have done an update to the camera IR algorithm and it has caused this none of the inside camera give false alerts and when i swap the cameras around from indoors to out door the same results happen with the out door cameras giving false positives .

I have lowered the sensitive down to like 5% on all outdoor cameras and still get so many false positives . They used to be on 80% sensitive for years and worked fine in the same position . So either 5 different cameras that were all purchased at different times and shops etc have all gone faulty at the same time which the probability is so astronomically insane or the most logical conclusion is an update they have done and not fixed the bugs on and admitting to .

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

jguerdat — Thu, 27 Sep 2018 13:25:49 GMT

I would test by removing one camera from Settings, My Devices and resync. Verify that the firmware on all devices is up to date.

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

Retired_Member — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 01:21:08 GMT

? what sort of advice is that ? As stated in previous reply I have swapped around the 5 cameras i have and the issue only happen when the cameras are outside so it is not a camera hardware issue . when I place the inside cameras outside in the same spot they give lots of false positives when i place the outdoor cameras inside i get no false positives from them . They base station has been reset also as at one stage all the cameras became un-synced .

As stated the cameras have been in the same position now for over 2 years and no significant changes to the outdoor environment eg shade , tree buildings etc have been made . I never used to get this amount of false positive reading prior with the sensitivity on like 80% however now I will get like 50 false positive in the morning at sunrise with the sensitivity on like 5% .

As stated in prior response the chances of 5 camera 2 are pro and 3 are regular Arlo cameras all pretty much purchased at different times and shops etc the chances of all 5 cameras going faulty at the same time is insane

As stated prior the most logical conclusion is that Arlo have updated the IR algorithm and it has caused this issue

I don’t seem to be the only person with this issue now and there are numerous threads with people stating the same issue

Re: Sun-related false positives - looking for input

DLinkOZ — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 02:50:57 GMT

The added service they now offer seems to have helped. I don't know if it's the improved detection logic or being able to set motion zones.