topic Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash? in Arlo Pro

Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Mon, 12 Mar 2018 05:28:02 GMT

I have noticed our two Arlo Pro cams nightvision IR LED's have been slow to respond after the worldwide outage the other day?

Prior to the outage, the thumbnails in the library were vibrant and bright. After the outage was fixed, our library thumbnails are very dark. When playing back the video, it takes about a second for the IR's to illuminate after motion is detected. So, when the snapshot is taken the instant motion is detected, the IR LED's are not yet lit and the thumbnail is very dark. It seems like it is deteriorating over time. This is happening on both of our cams.

Anyone else having this problem?

Images attached here from bright to darkest with dates.

https://imgur.com/a/nE3GU

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Mon, 12 Mar 2018 18:50:07 GMT

I downloaded video clips from March 5, 9 and 11 and put it into my editing program.

At 29.97 frames per second... and my rusty math, the NV IR is impeccable and equal across all three video captures. NV IR LED's activate within 100-133 milliseconds of motion detection across all three clips between frames 3 and 4 when downloaded. (Someone please check my math)

However, it appears the library thumbnails/snapshots are dark/delayed since the worldwide outage.

Clearly something has changed with the motion detection library snapshots since the outage???

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

JamesC — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 15:02:46 GMT

iseeyou2018,

I don't believe any changes were made to Night Vision. This could be due to changes in ambient light in the area. Are you still seeing this same behavior?

JamesC

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

pc2k17 — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 02:40:36 GMT

I've tried to respond to this post 5 times now, but my post never shows up......... trying again........

I'm seeing the exact same issue. The thumbnails are extremely dark after the outage the other day. I noticed it minutes after the outage was resolved. To me it looks like the snapshot for the thumbnail is being captured on frame 1 of the video, when the camera is still "fading in". Before the outage, the snapshot thumbnail was always captured a few frames into the video. I say it seems this way to me because before the outage, when I watched the video, there was always footage before the snapshot thumbnail. I have noticed this if the night vision kicks in AND when it's not, on a bright sunny day.

I supposed it could have something to do with the IR timing, but to me it seems like the snapshot for the thumbnail is being captured too early, before the camera fade in is complete when video starts recording. I'm not sure what's going on during the "fade in" period when a video starts recording, so I really have no idea what the issue is, except that the thumbnails in the app are so dark you can barely see them, almost just a black thumbnail.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

JPC — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 04:20:16 GMT

Agree.. Please fix it Arlo..

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

jguerdat — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 12:23:55 GMT

I don't know what, if anything, has changed but can remember various posts in the past years suggesting that the thumbnails were from frames further in the video and how users wanted 1st frames. Maybe that's been implemented?

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

pc2k17 — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 12:39:46 GMT

If they did implement this change, coming from an engineers perspective, that would be a foolish move. There is no reason why the thumbnail needs to display the first frame of the video, especially when the cameras use a fade in effect. That's probably why the arlo engineers had the thumbnail get captured a few frames in, because they know better then the typical end user on how their product works.

If this is the case, the fade in effect should be removed and the cameras should be instant on recording when detecting motion (minus the typical cloud lag). Unless the fade in effect is a hardware limitation in which case the thubnails should be captured a few frames in, after the fade in is complete.

I can only hope they did not implement such a change and it's just a server side setting that got reset and they just need to change it back. As of right now, night vision thumbnails are basically useless, just black squares and full light thumbnails are dimmed or dark.

Hopefully we can get a response from netgear on what's going on.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 21:37:08 GMT

@pc2k17wrote:... but to me it seems like the snapshot for the thumbnail is being captured too early, before the camera fade in is complete when video starts recording.

You are exactly correct.

Attached is a 10 second 6.8mb video I put together with side by side comparison between March 7 and March 14 with the associated thumbnails. This is from our second cam which doesn't see much activity aside from our friendly neighborhood raccoon (which we call Rocky), and a roaming cat (which we call Sandy).

Click for video - https://streamable.com/afkgt

You can see the March 7 clip on the left takes the associated snaptshot/thumbnail a bit after 2 secs into the clip (nearly 80 frames).

This is frame 80.

The March 14 clip on the right takes the snapshot/thumbnail in the first frame, frame 1.

This is Frame 1.

Something has definitely changed after the outage.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

pc2k17 — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 23:28:36 GMT

That video is perfect, what more proof do they need. I was going to try and find some time to put a comparison together, but you nailed, shows exactly what the issue is. Nice job.

(Btw - all my cameras are inside the house and inside the garage. I have to get some outside so I can capture the critters too. I had cats on my deck, deer right up at my window, but never a racoon on the deck, very cool)

So now that your video and screen shots show the issue definitvely, how do we get someone from netgear to address the issue?

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 00:01:30 GMT

@pc2k17wrote:
So now that your video and screen shots show the issue definitvely, how do we get someone from netgear to address the issue?

Not really sure. I've only had the system for about a month. I like it overall, but it sure would be nice to see clear thumbnails again.

I understand people complained in the past that the thumbnail capture was too delayed?

Perhaps a good compromise would be for the capture to be at frame 20 or so, which is still less than a second, yet the PIR will be fully illuminated and cam fully awake by that time, giving a clear snapshot.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

pc2k17 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 03:03:09 GMT

@iseeyou2018wrote:

Perhaps a good compromise would be for the capture to be at frame 20 or so, which is still less than a second, yet the PIR will be fully illuminated and cam fully awake by that time, giving a clear snapshot.

I agree a compromise would be nice. Lets see if @JamesC will respond to this post and the info you've posted. Hopefully he can engage the arlo engineers and get them to look into and/or fix the issue. I've had the system since June of 2017 and only had some questions about integrating arlo with smartthings, other than that no issues, except for this thumbnail issue. If we don't hear from JamesC, I'll try sending a private message to him. In the meantime, since I've really haven't tried any troubleshooting for this issue, I'll try the standard reboot the base and see if things change.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 03:16:51 GMT

@pc2k17wrote:
I'll try the standard reboot the base and see if things change.

I tried that, and resetting the battery packs. No change.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

pc2k17 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 03:24:32 GMT

@iseeyou2018wrote:
@pc2k17wrote:
I'll try the standard reboot the base and see if things change.
I tried that, and resetting the battery packs. No change.

Ok. Ya I just tried too, rebooted the base and no change. In my attached garage, when I open the house door to the garage smartthings turns on my LIFX+ lights automatically. So I turned the lights off before walking into the garage so that it would be in night vision mode. I thumbnail shows right when I walked out the door, 1st frame, and it's so dark I can barely see my brand new Lexus parked in there which is a very bright white color. This is even with the LIFX+ lights which when turned off emit IR light to help cameras see better. Hopefully JamesC will respond.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 03:46:02 GMT

Yeah, as you said, the nightvision Thumbnails are pretty useless now. Either they need to adjust the IR LED's to activate instantaneously on frame 1 (which they probably cannot achieve due to hardware), or adjust the thumbnail capture to frame 20+.

Edit: Or, even better, give us a slider in the software to adjust our own thumbnail capture frame. 🙂

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 05:09:33 GMT

The preview screens are pretty dark as well.

This is a screen capture after a motion triggered recording - (obviously frame 1, cannot see what triggered the cam)

It was triggered by my neighbor who approached from the far right..

This is after clicking the live feed for a reset - (I'm guessing the last frame)

Also note in both images, you can see the porch light is on indicated by the shadows from the railings onto the front sidewalk. It is harder to see in the darker image, but it is there if you look closely.

Edit: And just for sh'ts and grins - here is a capture with NV disabled after clicking live feed.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

JamesC — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 15:58:39 GMT

Thanks for the detailed description and screenshots, I will escalate this topic to engineering and request further investigation.

JamesC

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 20:16:20 GMT

@JamesCwrote:
Thanks for the detailed description and screenshots, I will escalate this topic to engineering and request further investigation.

JamesC

Thank you for your reply James.

If it helps, I also triggered the cam via motion detection with NV disabled last night. This was the result on the preview screen and associated thumbnail.

So, I don't think it is a PIR issue. It is a camera "wake" issue and change in snapshot/thumbnail frame, as pc2k17 correctly noted.

The solution being that snapshot/thumbnail previews need to be captured after frame 20. Otherwise, they are useless.

I look forward to the response from Engineering, and once again thank you for your reply.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

karambit — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 02:16:16 GMT

Yes, this is a serious problem.
The camera is basically unusable at night.
Previews are getting even worse, if that was possible.

Would love to hear what Netgear has planned and a timetable.
Or, full refunds if they cannot resolve this.

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

iseeyou2018 — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 06:53:37 GMT

@karambitwrote:
Would love to hear what Netgear has planned and a timetable.

Netgear is planning to separate from Arlo, and Arlo will be offering an IPO soon (Initial Public Offering... stock).

Although, with the consistant multiple threads in this "community" of complaints, I just hope Arlo gets their sh't together before the IPO, as I would like to buy some (of the IPO, not sh't).

Re: Arlo Pro NV IR slow to respond after database crash?

pc2k17 — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 13:06:58 GMT

@iseeyou2018

You have to remember people come to support forums because they are having an issue or have questions. People usually don't come to support forums to say: hey my product is working great. That's why it seems there are a lot of complaints and issues, but it's really that your only seeing one side of the story in a support forum.

I've been in IT for over 25 years and now work for an international company. One thing we constantly deal with here in the US is the teams in Europe have a different culture and they aren't as thorough as we are here. They make mistakes regularly and we have to clean up their messes. I'm not trying to defend the recent Arlo issues, some of which seem like they could have been avoidable, but things break and people make mistakes.

This thumnail issue isn't a deal breaker for me and it's the only issue I have with the system right now. Just means I can't really take a quick glance at night videos or low light videos during the day. I actually have to watch them to see what triggered the motion. However I do hope they address the issue soon.